"If harnessing the sun's rays to generate heat for pools is nothing new, then why are so few builders embracing it?"

This is taken from an article in the Pool & Spa News called, "Solar 101: Grasping the Basics"

"If harnessing the sun's rays to generate heat for pools is nothing new, then why are so few builders embracing it?"

The concept is simple but why are so few of us in the pool business shying away from it. I know that distribution has no idea which direction to take, yet this seems like the future of our business is staring us in the face. The sad reality is that those outside our industry are the ones making waves...why? Here is a part of this article that was written on 12/15/2010 by Dan Schechner, I have posted the link to the web page at the bottom for those who are still interested. Are any of you doing anything with solar?

"In years past, when John Kennedy sold solar pool heating systems, he often would team up with a local installation company. Back then, the owner of Elite-Weiler Pools, a Pool & Spa News Top Builder in Sarasota, Fla., simply consulted a price list, put together a package, and then sent a purchase order to his solar partner.Today, Kennedy is a certified solar contractor who owns and operates Elite Solar Services. The classification allows him to install solar electric (photovoltaic) pool heating systems, as well as solar domestic and commercial hot water units.“In Florida, it gives you an 11-month-a-year swim season,” he says of the typically roof-mounted pool heating devices. “Plus it saves the consumer money, and it’s good for the environment. There are a number of applications for it — it’s just a matter of getting it explained and finding the space.”Indeed, a small but growing number of pool contractors have caught the solar wave in recent years, albeit to varying degrees. Some have incorporated full-fledged solar divisions, while others have begun selling the systems and subcontracting or outsourcing the installation and service.Still, Kennedy concedes it’s a business that shouldn’t be entered into lightly: “It’s not something you can just stick your toe into, because of the nature of the work,” he says. “You need a crew specialized and trained to do it — you can’t decide one day that the tile setters are suddenly going to be your solar setters on the roof.”At a time when new pool construction remains stagnant throughout much of the country, solar installation could present a bright spot for contractors. Here, experts discuss some of the basics while dispelling myths and misconceptions about the business."

http://www.poolspanews.com/2010/121/121solar.html

Replies

Don Parish January 13, 2011 at 8:39am

Yeah, Unfortunately you guys seem to be the Guinea Pigs of America

Jeff Tarr said:
Eventually? Try living in California, lol!

Don Parish said:
Like everything else, if we don't get ahead of it now the governments going to shove it down our throats eventually.
Wood Stove Pools January 13, 2011 at 7:56am

We have heard California has some strict parameters around burning wood. We have designed our wood burning pool heater identical to a modern wood stove someone would put in their house. We have a secondary combustion chamber that ignites the secondary gases ensuring the unit doesn't smoke when using season hardwood. The secondary combustion chamber on our wood burning pool heater consists of an air fed baffle which introduces oxygen to the fire causing it to ignite resulting in an efficient wood burning pool heater. We are in the process of obtaining our EPA certification, we have a potential customer in California taking this to his local government. It will be interesting to see the response. But don't forget there are millions of pools in North America, many of these pools are in rural areas, where gas is not an option and propane is too expensive.
Jeff Tarr January 13, 2011 at 12:06am

Eventually? Try living in California, lol!

Don Parish said:
Like everything else, if we don't get ahead of it now the governments going to shove it down our throats eventually.
Scott Tarr January 12, 2011 at 6:52pm

Obviously, many differing points of view on this matter. I love the discourse and appreciate everyone's input. PGN is a great resource for our industry and this forum is an example of how beneficial the site is for all of us. Thanks for all the conversation!!
Richard A. Falk January 12, 2011 at 6:46pm

Thanks for "The Green Factor" link. However, as you can see in this link and this link, on Spare the Air days one cannot burn wood or pellets indoors or outdoors. Read this link about fine particulate matter. It is true that EPA certified wood stoves are better than a simple fireplace, but this EPA file does not list any manufacturer or model with "pool", "dome" or "WSP" in the name so can you please give me your EPA registration number for your WSP Silverdome product? Or are you only selling in Canada and not in the United States?
David Penton January 12, 2011 at 5:15pm

We can't even put in wood burning Fire Places in many municipalities!

Plus, you have to "Feed" wood into the system constantly... If you need 20 degrees of heat rise (not uncommon) this will take 2 days of constant monitoring and "feeding" fuel in order to get the pool warmed up. This doesn't seem practical.

Won't work in my area...

Wood Stove Pools said:

the link below explains how burning wood in a proper stove is considered a "green innovation"

http://www.woodstovepools.com/the-green-factor.html
Wood Stove Pools January 12, 2011 at 12:25pm

the link below explains how burning wood in a proper stove is considered a "green innovation"

http://www.woodstovepools.com/the-green-factor.html
Richard A. Falk January 12, 2011 at 12:16pm

I don't know how burning wood can be considered to be a "green innovation". I don't think anyone is proposing using only solar in areas that have iffy weather or need extended seasons. It's really solar plus natural gas or a heat pump. Though natural gas still produces carbon dioxide, it burns cleanly and does not produce soot or fine particulate matter that can be harmful to health. In our area, we have "spare the air" days where burning wood (or even firelogs such as Duraflame) are prohibited.
Wood Stove Pools January 12, 2011 at 11:51am

We find in the Canadian climate, there are too many variables with our weather. I did have an expensive solar system, but was tired of having a cold pool when family and friends were over without any control over the temp. Sure the party day was nice and hot but the week prior the weather was cloudy and in tern I had a cold pool without anyone swimming. This has lead to a green innovation that has taken off in Canada and is gaining popularity in the USA.

Wood Stove Pools (www.woodstovepools.com) presents a green product which gives you control again ensuring your pool is warm when needed.
Scott Heusser January 6, 2011 at 11:43am

Richard,

Efficient was an incorrect choice of words. I live in Idaho where in most parts of the state the wind machine turns on at 3 PM and runs most of the night, and have very defined seasons, ie cloudy days spring and fall. Glazed panels are much more effective than the standard poly panels in these conditions.

Richard A. Falk said:

Pentair does have controllers with solar priority, but that's a gripe I have with my Pentair IntelliTouch system. It is unable to have both gas AND solar on at the same time (unless one is doing this manually in service mode). There are times when there is sufficient sun for solar to go on, but I need the pool to get hotter faster so want to use gas as well (where I turn on the gas explicitly with a program for that). With the Pentair controller, I'm forced to choose since the automatic Solar function and the Heater function are mutually exclusive.

Most solar panel systems have a controller that has temperature sensor inputs for the panel vs. the water temp and can control a 3-way valve to only have solar operating when it can provide reasonable heat. One does not need a full (more expensive) automation system in order to get this function and my original pool install had a simple solar-only controller as part of the solar package. I totally agree that it is far easier to pipe in and install solar when a pool is first built and that it can be much more costly and difficult to retrofit, though this depends a lot on the specifics of pump location, hardscape, etc.

As for glazed vs. poly panels, when there is little or no wind and the air temp during the day isn't much colder than the water temp, the poly panels are actually more efficient than glazed as seen in this post where a good poly panel is 80% (or more) efficient while a glazed panel is 74% efficient and that doesn't even include the losses in the heat exchanger since glazed panels almost always use their own fluid and not pool water. See this link for actual ratings of many solar pool systems. The better poly panels are around 1000 BTU/sq.ft. (the FAFCO Revolution are 1063); unfortunately, glazed panels using copper tubing are not listed. Glazed panels for domestic hot water heating (and also for pool) are listed in this link where most are 850-900 BTU/sq.ft. (the Solar Development SD6A is 979), but again this does not include losses from the required heat exchanger (manufacturers do not want chlorinated pool water in their copper piping in the panels). Where the glazed panels do really well is when the air is cooler, especially if there is wind, and when the sun is not as intense, including cloudy days. They therefore perform better at the start and end of the season, but that's when you normally want solar most -- to extend the season.